Blackberry vs Windows Mobile

This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows Mobile 6
phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync any/all folders I want
including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over the air"
via Verizon.

1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows Mobile can?
2. Is there anything special I have to do.
3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a Blackberry to work
with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully not
additional server piece).

Costas
Wed May 14 10:33:24 PDT 2008

Configuring WM is straight forward because there isn't anything special you
have to do. BlackBerry is more involved and it requires BES (BlackBerry
Enterprise Server) installed on either your server or a member server of
your network.

Using BES you can sync contacts, emails, calendar and with the addition of a
free application, you can sync Google emails too. Soon, you will be able to
sync live.com emails also (hotmail.com, live.com). That's based on an
article I read yesterday.

Step-by-Step instructions on how to setup a BES can be found at
http://costas.cpstechgroup.com/?p=20


--
Costas


"Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:9EC9F051-3639-4620-BCC9-AFE294428C76@microsoft.com...
> This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows Mobile 6
> phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync any/all folders I
> want
> including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over the
> air"
> via Verizon.
>
> 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows Mobile can?
> 2. Is there anything special I have to do.
> 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a Blackberry to
> work
> with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully not
> additional server piece).
>

Lanwench
Wed May 14 10:35:02 PDT 2008

Richard K <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
> This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows Mobile
> 6 phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync any/all
> folders I want including calendars and contacts?

You can sync your own mailbox calendar, contacts, tasks, and email folders
wirelessly. You can't sync public folders or Outlook Notes or other users'
mailbox folders.

> I want to do this
> syncing "over the air" via Verizon.
>
> 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows Mobile
> can?

If you have Blackberry Enterprise Server, yes. If not, no; all you can get
is wireless e-mail, and it's a terrible kluge. There's a free (rather,
"included") license for the "lite" version of BES if you have a Blackberry
and you can add licenses as needed. But I would still recommend purchasing a
support contract from Blackberry.

> 2. Is there anything special I have to do.

For what?

>
> 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a Blackberry
> to work with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and
> hopefully not additional server piece).

For this, you would really need BES - and if you're wise you will not even
attempt to install it on your SBS server or any server running Exchange. You
can put it in a virtual W2003 server on your SBS box if you have enough
firepower. But then you may need another license for Windows server.

RichardK
Wed May 14 10:39:08 PDT 2008

This maybe a stupid question.... but I saw a pricing of $3000 for the BES on
top SBS/Exchange box. If I only have 2-3 clients that's VERY pricey compared
to the built in WM I get through OWA which costs me nothing. Is there
something I'm missing here? Are there other options than BES?

"Costas" wrote:

> Configuring WM is straight forward because there isn't anything special you
> have to do. BlackBerry is more involved and it requires BES (BlackBerry
> Enterprise Server) installed on either your server or a member server of
> your network.
>
> Using BES you can sync contacts, emails, calendar and with the addition of a
> free application, you can sync Google emails too. Soon, you will be able to
> sync live.com emails also (hotmail.com, live.com). That's based on an
> article I read yesterday.
>
> Step-by-Step instructions on how to setup a BES can be found at
> http://costas.cpstechgroup.com/?p=20
>
>
> --
> Costas
>
>
> "Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:9EC9F051-3639-4620-BCC9-AFE294428C76@microsoft.com...
> > This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows Mobile 6
> > phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync any/all folders I
> > want
> > including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over the
> > air"
> > via Verizon.
> >
> > 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows Mobile can?
> > 2. Is there anything special I have to do.
> > 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a Blackberry to
> > work
> > with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully not
> > additional server piece).
> >
>

Lanwench
Wed May 14 10:41:56 PDT 2008

Richard K <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote:
> This maybe a stupid question.... but I saw a pricing of $3000 for the
> BES on top SBS/Exchange box.

The full version plus a server to run it on can be expensive. Please see my
reply to your original post. If I only have 2-3 clients that's VERY
> pricey compared to the built in WM I get through OWA

Not thru OWA; thru Exchange.

> which costs me
> nothing. Is there something I'm missing here? Are there other
> options than BES?

Yes. Use Windows Mobile.
>
> "Costas" wrote:
>
>> Configuring WM is straight forward because there isn't anything
>> special you have to do. BlackBerry is more involved and it requires
>> BES (BlackBerry Enterprise Server) installed on either your server
>> or a member server of your network.
>>
>> Using BES you can sync contacts, emails, calendar and with the
>> addition of a free application, you can sync Google emails too.
>> Soon, you will be able to sync live.com emails also (hotmail.com,
>> live.com). That's based on an article I read yesterday.
>>
>> Step-by-Step instructions on how to setup a BES can be found at
>> http://costas.cpstechgroup.com/?p=20
>>
>>
>> --
>> Costas
>>
>>
>> "Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:9EC9F051-3639-4620-BCC9-AFE294428C76@microsoft.com...
>>> This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows
>>> Mobile 6 phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync
>>> any/all folders I want
>>> including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over
>>> the air"
>>> via Verizon.
>>>
>>> 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows
>>> Mobile can?
>>> 2. Is there anything special I have to do.
>>> 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a
>>> Blackberry to work
>>> with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully not
>>> additional server piece).

Costas
Wed May 14 10:53:13 PDT 2008

There is a free edition, BlackBerry Professional Express, which includes one
license and can be upgraded up to 30 licenses for $100/license

Here is the link
http://na.blackberry.com/eng/services/server/offers/professional_express.jsp
(actually I have to update the blog post with the new URL)
--
Costas


"Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:41F51594-BD86-409C-A3F7-86A3E04772EB@microsoft.com...
> This maybe a stupid question.... but I saw a pricing of $3000 for the BES
> on
> top SBS/Exchange box. If I only have 2-3 clients that's VERY pricey
> compared
> to the built in WM I get through OWA which costs me nothing. Is there
> something I'm missing here? Are there other options than BES?
>
> "Costas" wrote:
>
>> Configuring WM is straight forward because there isn't anything special
>> you
>> have to do. BlackBerry is more involved and it requires BES (BlackBerry
>> Enterprise Server) installed on either your server or a member server of
>> your network.
>>
>> Using BES you can sync contacts, emails, calendar and with the addition
>> of a
>> free application, you can sync Google emails too. Soon, you will be able
>> to
>> sync live.com emails also (hotmail.com, live.com). That's based on an
>> article I read yesterday.
>>
>> Step-by-Step instructions on how to setup a BES can be found at
>> http://costas.cpstechgroup.com/?p=20
>>
>>
>> --
>> Costas
>>
>>
>> "Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:9EC9F051-3639-4620-BCC9-AFE294428C76@microsoft.com...
>> > This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows Mobile 6
>> > phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync any/all folders I
>> > want
>> > including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over the
>> > air"
>> > via Verizon.
>> >
>> > 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows Mobile
>> > can?
>> > 2. Is there anything special I have to do.
>> > 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a Blackberry to
>> > work
>> > with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully not
>> > additional server piece).
>> >
>>

aus
Wed May 14 16:19:19 PDT 2008

Richard K wrote:
> This maybe a stupid question.... but I saw a pricing of $3000 for the BES on
> top SBS/Exchange box. If I only have 2-3 clients that's VERY pricey compared
> to the built in WM I get through OWA which costs me nothing. Is there
> something I'm missing here? Are there other options than BES?
>
> "Costas" wrote:
>
>> Configuring WM is straight forward because there isn't anything special you
>> have to do. BlackBerry is more involved and it requires BES (BlackBerry
>> Enterprise Server) installed on either your server or a member server of
>> your network.
>>
>> Using BES you can sync contacts, emails, calendar and with the addition of a
>> free application, you can sync Google emails too. Soon, you will be able to
>> sync live.com emails also (hotmail.com, live.com). That's based on an
>> article I read yesterday.
>>
>> Step-by-Step instructions on how to setup a BES can be found at
>> http://costas.cpstechgroup.com/?p=20
>>
>>
>> --
>> Costas
>>
>>
>> "Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:9EC9F051-3639-4620-BCC9-AFE294428C76@microsoft.com...
>>> This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows Mobile 6
>>> phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync any/all folders I
>>> want
>>> including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over the
>>> air"
>>> via Verizon.
>>>
>>> 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows Mobile can?
>>> 2. Is there anything special I have to do.
>>> 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a Blackberry to
>>> work
>>> with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully not
>>> additional server piece).
>>>

As mentioned BES is free for the first user. So if you are thinking of
trying it out then there's no cost but installing it you need to read
around so you understand what you are doing with SBS.

Is there an alternate? - yes the Desktop Redirector - which every
Blackberry comes with - allows synchronising of Outlook messages,
Calendar, Tasks, Notes and address book. It runs on the users desktop PC
and requires the PC be left on but there is no server side config. Its a
very easy setup - many clients do it themselves.

If you have a handful of users the Blackberry Enterprise Server isnt
really worth it unless you must have centralised control and management.

Alan
Wed May 14 17:31:39 PDT 2008



"Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
news:9EC9F051-3639-4620-BCC9-AFE294428C76@microsoft.com...
> This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows
> Mobile 6
> phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync any/all
> folders I want
> including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over
> the air"
> via Verizon.
>
> 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows Mobile
> can?
> 2. Is there anything special I have to do.
> 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a Blackberry
> to work
> with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully not
> additional server piece).
>

Hi,

Just as an aside to the other responses, I wonder if there is also a
very different security / risk profile with BlackBerry?

As soon as you engage in true 'push' email (where the emails get sent
direct to the end user's PDA) then you are, it seems to me, routing
your emails through a third party provider (I assume either RIM or one
of their partners).

Now, that is fine for you if you know and are happy with it, but I
have a concern about emails I might send to you that are confidential,
then being passed onto some third party that I do not know about. If
I want to send my email to you securely, I can choose to do that (if
you and I agree), but how do I know that RIM is secure and cannot read
my email that I securely passed from my server to yours?


Flip side is pull email (using, say, ActiveSync). If I create a
secure (SSL) connection from my PDA to my Exchange Server and 'pull'
in the emails then I *know* that no-one else can have read them
(assuming that SSL is still secure!)


Is that correct?

Thanks,

--

Alan.

The views expressed are my own, and not those of my employer or anyone
else associated with me.

My current valid email address is:

1bupdvc02@sneakemail.com

This is valid as is. It is not munged, or altered at all.

It will be valid for AT LEAST one month from the date of this post.

If you are trying to contact me after that time,
it MAY still be valid, but may also have been
deactivated due to spam. If so, and you want
to contact me by email, try searching for a
more recent post by me to find my current
email address.

The following is a (probably!) totally unique
and meaningless string of characters that you
can use to find posts by me in a search engine:

ewygchvboocno43vb674b6nq46tvb

aus
Wed May 14 20:05:09 PDT 2008


Alan wrote:
> "Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
> news:9EC9F051-3639-4620-BCC9-AFE294428C76@microsoft.com...
>> This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows
>> Mobile 6
>> phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync any/all
>> folders I want
>> including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over
>> the air"
>> via Verizon.
>>
>> 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows Mobile
>> can?
>> 2. Is there anything special I have to do.
>> 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a Blackberry
>> to work
>> with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully not
>> additional server piece).
>>
>
> Hi,
>
> Just as an aside to the other responses, I wonder if there is also a
> very different security / risk profile with BlackBerry?
>
> As soon as you engage in true 'push' email (where the emails get sent
> direct to the end user's PDA) then you are, it seems to me, routing
> your emails through a third party provider (I assume either RIM or one
> of their partners).
>
> Now, that is fine for you if you know and are happy with it, but I
> have a concern about emails I might send to you that are confidential,
> then being passed onto some third party that I do not know about. If
> I want to send my email to you securely, I can choose to do that (if
> you and I agree), but how do I know that RIM is secure and cannot read
> my email that I securely passed from my server to yours?
>
>
> Flip side is pull email (using, say, ActiveSync). If I create a
> secure (SSL) connection from my PDA to my Exchange Server and 'pull'
> in the emails then I *know* that no-one else can have read them
> (assuming that SSL is still secure!)
>
>
> Is that correct?
>
> Thanks,
>

But SMTP mail isnt encrypted anyway - so all the mail you send day in
and out goes through your ISP and the recipients ISP plus countess
systems on the way. So, how is using a Blueberry less secure in reality?

As with PC based email security you can get a client add-on to encrypt
data at both ends if you are worried or use Exchange certificates with
sMIME option on the BB.

Lanwench
Thu May 15 06:21:12 PDT 2008

aus <aus@aus.net> wrote:
> Richard K wrote:
>> This maybe a stupid question.... but I saw a pricing of $3000 for
>> the BES on top SBS/Exchange box. If I only have 2-3 clients that's
>> VERY pricey compared to the built in WM I get through OWA which
>> costs me nothing. Is there something I'm missing here? Are there
>> other options than BES? "Costas" wrote:
>>
>>> Configuring WM is straight forward because there isn't anything
>>> special you have to do. BlackBerry is more involved and it
>>> requires BES (BlackBerry Enterprise Server) installed on either
>>> your server or a member server of your network.
>>>
>>> Using BES you can sync contacts, emails, calendar and with the
>>> addition of a free application, you can sync Google emails too. Soon,
>>> you will be able to sync live.com emails also (hotmail.com,
>>> live.com). That's based on an article I read yesterday.
>>>
>>> Step-by-Step instructions on how to setup a BES can be found at
>>> http://costas.cpstechgroup.com/?p=20
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> Costas
>>>
>>>
>>> "Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>>> news:9EC9F051-3639-4620-BCC9-AFE294428C76@microsoft.com...
>>>> This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows
>>>> Mobile 6 phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync
>>>> any/all folders I want
>>>> including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over
>>>> the air"
>>>> via Verizon.
>>>>
>>>> 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows
>>>> Mobile can? 2. Is there anything special I have to do.
>>>> 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a
>>>> Blackberry to work
>>>> with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully
>>>> not additional server piece).
>>>>
>
> As mentioned BES is free for the first user. So if you are thinking of
> trying it out then there's no cost but installing it you need to read
> around so you understand what you are doing with SBS.

Yep - and the wise do not install it directly on SBS (or any server running
Exchange). You *can* .... but that doesn't mean you *should*.
>
> Is there an alternate? - yes the Desktop Redirector - which every
> Blackberry comes with - allows synchronising of Outlook messages,
> Calendar, Tasks, Notes and address book. It runs on the users desktop
> PC and requires the PC be left on but there is no server side config.
> Its a very easy setup - many clients do it themselves.

Yep- but it's not foolproof, and requires that the user remain logged in at
all times. I discourage this. Blackberry Internet Services has an option
which allows the device to use email via OWA and a proxy) and is better -
though still not as good as BES.
>
> If you have a handful of users the Blackberry Enterprise Server isnt
> really worth it unless you must have centralised control and
> management.

And security. That's also a big deal. Without BES there's no remote wipe.

Tony
Thu May 15 07:32:21 PDT 2008

Except email within the organization. With WM isn't the device connecting
directly to your server with a secure connection so it never goes on anyone
else's network unencrypted?

With RIM/BB it has to go through their network and held on their servers
somewhere if only for a moment. Is that also a secure connetion?

I have used both WM and BES in the past and WM was way easier to setup and
manage. WM isn't flawless but the expense of BES was not justified.

The BES I used was with Exchange 2000 - pre-active sync.

Tony

Tony


"aus" <aus@aus.net> wrote in message
news:O2VA8hjtIHA.748@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
> Alan wrote:
>> "Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:9EC9F051-3639-4620-BCC9-AFE294428C76@microsoft.com...
>>> This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows Mobile 6
>>> phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync any/all folders I
>>> want
>>> including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over the
>>> air"
>>> via Verizon.
>>>
>>> 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows Mobile
>>> can?
>>> 2. Is there anything special I have to do.
>>> 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a Blackberry to
>>> work
>>> with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully not
>>> additional server piece).
>>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Just as an aside to the other responses, I wonder if there is also a very
>> different security / risk profile with BlackBerry?
>>
>> As soon as you engage in true 'push' email (where the emails get sent
>> direct to the end user's PDA) then you are, it seems to me, routing your
>> emails through a third party provider (I assume either RIM or one of
>> their partners).
>>
>> Now, that is fine for you if you know and are happy with it, but I have a
>> concern about emails I might send to you that are confidential, then
>> being passed onto some third party that I do not know about. If I want
>> to send my email to you securely, I can choose to do that (if you and I
>> agree), but how do I know that RIM is secure and cannot read my email
>> that I securely passed from my server to yours?
>>
>>
>> Flip side is pull email (using, say, ActiveSync). If I create a secure
>> (SSL) connection from my PDA to my Exchange Server and 'pull' in the
>> emails then I *know* that no-one else can have read them (assuming that
>> SSL is still secure!)
>>
>>
>> Is that correct?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>
> But SMTP mail isnt encrypted anyway - so all the mail you send day in and
> out goes through your ISP and the recipients ISP plus countess systems on
> the way. So, how is using a Blueberry less secure in reality?
>
> As with PC based email security you can get a client add-on to encrypt
> data at both ends if you are worried or use Exchange certificates with
> sMIME option on the BB.

Alan
Thu May 15 14:17:16 PDT 2008




"aus" <aus@aus.net> wrote in message
news:O2VA8hjtIHA.748@TK2MSFTNGP05.phx.gbl...
> Alan wrote:
>> "Richard K" <RichardK@discussions.microsoft.com> wrote in message
>> news:9EC9F051-3639-4620-BCC9-AFE294428C76@microsoft.com...
>>> This is more of a general question. I have configured Windows
>>> Mobile 6
>>> phones and it's quite easy with SBS 2003. Can I sync any/all
>>> folders I want
>>> including calendars and contacts? I want to do this syncing "over
>>> the air"
>>> via Verizon.
>>>
>>> 1. Can Blackberry sync all of the same things that a Windows
>>> Mobile can?
>>> 2. Is there anything special I have to do.
>>> 3. More importantly, any instructions on how to set up a
>>> Blackberry to work
>>> with my SBS 2003 with the least amount of trouble (and hopefully
>>> not
>>> additional server piece).
>>>
>>
>> Hi,
>>
>> Just as an aside to the other responses, I wonder if there is also
>> a very different security / risk profile with BlackBerry?
>>
>> As soon as you engage in true 'push' email (where the emails get
>> sent direct to the end user's PDA) then you are, it seems to me,
>> routing your emails through a third party provider (I assume either
>> RIM or one of their partners).
>>
>> Now, that is fine for you if you know and are happy with it, but I
>> have a concern about emails I might send to you that are
>> confidential, then being passed onto some third party that I do not
>> know about. If I want to send my email to you securely, I can
>> choose to do that (if you and I agree), but how do I know that RIM
>> is secure and cannot read my email that I securely passed from my
>> server to yours?
>>
>>
>> Flip side is pull email (using, say, ActiveSync). If I create a
>> secure (SSL) connection from my PDA to my Exchange Server and
>> 'pull' in the emails then I *know* that no-one else can have read
>> them (assuming that SSL is still secure!)
>>
>>
>> Is that correct?
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>
> But SMTP mail isnt encrypted anyway - so all the mail you send day
> in and out goes through your ISP and the recipients ISP plus
> countess systems on the way. So, how is using a Blueberry less
> secure in reality?
>

Hi,

I guess your setup is quite different to ours potentially, but if I
send an email to one of my colleagues it *does not* go outside our
systems... unless they are using a BlackBerry in which case my guess
is that it now does.

If my colleague is usoing WM then their device connects to our system
(point to point albeit over public network) using SSL encryption, so
the data is never outside of our control unencrypted.

I guess that if you are in a more distributed environment you might
use your ISP to hold you email in your particular business?

>
> As with PC based email security you can get a client add-on to
> encrypt data at both ends if you are worried or use Exchange
> certificates with sMIME option on the BB.
>

Okay - that seems to be more like it.

I was also under the impression that BlackBerry took the 'Apple'
approach and dictated what you can and can't install on their
devices - hence potentially no option to use a third party encryption
application.

If BlackBerry devices aren't so locked down as I had thought, then
presumably I could just buy and install an application that will do
exactly the same as our WM devices and use SSL encryption / ActiveSync
to talk directly to the exchange server - that would be the best way
to do it and avoid RIM's servers altogether?

Thanks,
--

Alan.

The views expressed are my own, and not those of my employer or anyone
else associated with me.

My current valid email address is:

1bupdvc02@sneakemail.com

This is valid as is. It is not munged, or altered at all.

It will be valid for AT LEAST one month from the date of this post.

If you are trying to contact me after that time,
it MAY still be valid, but may also have been
deactivated due to spam. If so, and you want
to contact me by email, try searching for a
more recent post by me to find my current
email address.

The following is a (probably!) totally unique
and meaningless string of characters that you
can use to find posts by me in a search engine:

ewygchvboocno43vb674b6nq46tvb