AMD Opteron: 1-way, 2-way, ... Up to 8-way.

Sorry if I'm a pest...

Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
behind that.

"The AMD Opteron? processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
"(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to 8-way)."

What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know
for sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade
off between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the
100 and 200 series.

John

M
Sat Dec 24 19:36:11 CST 2005

The multi-way architecture refers to the means by which the CPUs share
system memory. Multi-processing has long been the common approach to
getting satisfactory server performance where demand for CPU cycles is high
and system and applications software has been optimized to make the most of
multiple processors, commonly, but not always, by means of a programming
technique called multi-threading.

You are right, you probably don't need 8-way capability on the desktop -
yet. Likewise, the Opteron chip was targeted at the outset on servers, but
I'm sitting in front of a dual CPU Opteron workstation right now. With the
advent of dual core 200 series Opterons, I could upgrade to the equivalent
of 4-way processing on the desktop. It's a bit too pricey to consider right
now, but that will change over time.

OTOH, if you are running a honking huge domain, you might want an 8-way
machine to handle any of a variety of compute-intensive roles. And 8-way is
just the low end of the high end. There are 16, 32 and 64 way systems out
there running Enterprise and Datacenter versions of Windows right now. And
Microsoft's push into the hight performance computing space means there may
be complexes of hundreds, or even thousands of CPUs running Windows cluster
software doing supercomputing chores in the near future.

"John John" <audetweld@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote in message
news:OuchsNNCGHA.3292@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
> Sorry if I'm a pest...
>
> Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
> behind that.
>
> "The AMD Opteron? processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
> "(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to 8-way)."
>
> What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
> application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know for
> sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade off
> between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the 100 and
> 200 series.
>
> John

Charlie
Sun Dec 25 00:41:23 CST 2005

The 100 chips are designed to be the only CPU in the system, the 200 is
designed to be one of two chips. A 2x200 series with dual cores would give
you 4 opterons, effectively. A monster board, capable of doing just about
anything you're likely to need. An 8way is really only for servers..

Realistically, a single CPU, with dual cores, is probably more than pretty
much any normal user needs.


--
Charlie.
http://msmvps.com/xperts64

John John wrote:
> Sorry if I'm a pest...
>
> Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
> behind that.
>
> "The AMD Opteron? processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
> "(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to 8-way)."
>
> What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
> application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know
> for sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade
> off between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the
> 100 and 200 series.
>
> John

Steve
Sun Dec 25 14:44:50 CST 2005

John John wrote:

>Sorry if I'm a pest...
>
>Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
>behind that.
>
>"The AMD Opteron? processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
>"(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to 8-way)."
>
>What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
>application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know for
>sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade off
>between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the 100 and
>200 series.

They mean how many of the processors are supported on a single
motherboard. So the 100 series are intended to be used on single CPU
motherboards, the 200 series can be used on dual processor motherboards,
and the 800 series can be used on motherboards with as many as 8 CPU
sockets.

On top of this, some Opterons are dual-core, which means AMD have squeezed
the equivalent of two standard Opterons onto a single chip, and you need
to make sure any motherboard you choose supports dual-core chips if you
intend to buy a dual-core Opteron.

AMD's roadmap has processors with even more cores, so a single physical
chip of tomorrow will work like multiple chips of today.

--
Steve Foster [SBS MVP]
---------------------------------------
MVPs do not work for Microsoft. Please reply only to the newsgroups.

John
Mon Dec 26 11:58:19 CST 2005

Thanks, very informative.

John

M. Murcek wrote:

> The multi-way architecture refers to the means by which the CPUs share
> system memory. Multi-processing has long been the common approach to
> getting satisfactory server performance where demand for CPU cycles is high
> and system and applications software has been optimized to make the most of
> multiple processors, commonly, but not always, by means of a programming
> technique called multi-threading.
>
> You are right, you probably don't need 8-way capability on the desktop -
> yet. Likewise, the Opteron chip was targeted at the outset on servers, but
> I'm sitting in front of a dual CPU Opteron workstation right now. With the
> advent of dual core 200 series Opterons, I could upgrade to the equivalent
> of 4-way processing on the desktop. It's a bit too pricey to consider right
> now, but that will change over time.
>
> OTOH, if you are running a honking huge domain, you might want an 8-way
> machine to handle any of a variety of compute-intensive roles. And 8-way is
> just the low end of the high end. There are 16, 32 and 64 way systems out
> there running Enterprise and Datacenter versions of Windows right now. And
> Microsoft's push into the hight performance computing space means there may
> be complexes of hundreds, or even thousands of CPUs running Windows cluster
> software doing supercomputing chores in the near future.
>
> "John John" <audetweld@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote in message
> news:OuchsNNCGHA.3292@TK2MSFTNGP09.phx.gbl...
>
>>Sorry if I'm a pest...
>>
>>Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
>>behind that.
>>
>>"The AMD Opteron? processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
>>"(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to 8-way)."
>>
>>What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
>>application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know for
>>sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade off
>>between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the 100 and
>>200 series.
>>
>>John
>
>
>

John
Mon Dec 26 12:02:56 CST 2005

Thanks, interesting about the AMD roadmap. I'm wondering if Intel isn't
secretly reworking its Itanium... maybe when 64 bit computing is a bit
more mainstream they might come back with a vengeance.

John

Steve Foster [SBS MVP] wrote:

> John John wrote:
>
>> Sorry if I'm a pest...
>>
>> Could someone point me in the right direction or explain the concept
>> behind that.
>>
>> "The AMD Opteron? processor is offered in three series: the 100 series
>> "(1-way), the 200 series (Up to 2-way), and the 800 series (Up to
>> 8-way)."
>>
>> What does it do in multiple ways? Which kind of user or what kind of
>> application would benefit from the different 1 or 2-way chips? I know
>> for sure I have no need for 8-way, but I would like to know the trade
>> off between saving now and sacrificing future performance between the
>> 100 and 200 series.
>
>
> They mean how many of the processors are supported on a single
> motherboard. So the 100 series are intended to be used on single CPU
> motherboards, the 200 series can be used on dual processor motherboards,
> and the 800 series can be used on motherboards with as many as 8 CPU
> sockets.
>
> On top of this, some Opterons are dual-core, which means AMD have
> squeezed the equivalent of two standard Opterons onto a single chip, and
> you need to make sure any motherboard you choose supports dual-core
> chips if you intend to buy a dual-core Opteron.
>
> AMD's roadmap has processors with even more cores, so a single physical
> chip of tomorrow will work like multiple chips of today.
>

John
Mon Dec 26 13:00:12 CST 2005

Thanks Charlie. The pc is for my 13 year old nephew. He called me
about 3 weeks ago and told me he wanted money for Christmas! Then he
explained that he mowed lawns all summer and that he does odd jobs and
is saving his money for a computer, he figures he's going to have 8 or
900 dollars available. So I said ok. I asked him what kind of computer
and where was he going to buy it. He told me he was going to go to a
big box or big office supply chain type of store, I told him to look
around but that I would go with him to buy the pc, to make sure he
doesn't get taken for a ride.

Then his mother told me she wanted to buy him a laptop! Because her
girlfriends at work told her that when he goes to college or university
the laptop would be useful! I told her that in 4 or 5 years from now
the laptop will make a fine doorstop or a nice Frisbee for 18 year old
university students on a Friday night drunk! To make matters worse he
told a clerk at a big office supply chain that he didn't want a flat
panel monitor (for gaming) and the clerk told him that CRT's were no
longer available and that they don't even work on new pc's! So I told
him that my gift to him would be the monitor and that I would find him a
suitable pc with the money he manages to save. I got him one of the
last Aperture Grill monitor still available today.

Then I thought to myself, what is the best thing to get for a 13 year
old kid? I figured when he's 17 or 18 if he needs extra power he
probably won't have money to buy a new pc. I also figured I may as well
get him a 64 bit ready pc and make sure it has lots of room and options
for future upgradability. I think I will get him a dual core, dual
Opteron ready motherboard but I will only throw a single core 200 in
there. Also, I think I will only put XP 32 bit on there for now, I
think he's too young and inexperienced for Windows x64. Later on if he
needs more he can pay for it himself! And if he does get that from me
you can be sure that "Uncle John" will have his lawn mowed for free next
summer!

John

Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:

> The 100 chips are designed to be the only CPU in the system, the 200 is
> designed to be one of two chips. A 2x200 series with dual cores would give
> you 4 opterons, effectively. A monster board, capable of doing just about
> anything you're likely to need. An 8way is really only for servers..
>
> Realistically, a single CPU, with dual cores, is probably more than pretty
> much any normal user needs.
>
>

Charlie
Mon Dec 26 15:35:23 CST 2005

Don't waste your (and his) money on a dual opteron board. Get a good "gamer"
board that does Athlon64 and put a dual-core in there. Spend the money on
the graphics card(s) for it, and plenty of RAM. He'll be fine for years.

--
Charlie.
http://msmvps.com/xperts64

John John wrote:
> Thanks Charlie. The pc is for my 13 year old nephew. He called me
> about 3 weeks ago and told me he wanted money for Christmas! Then he
> explained that he mowed lawns all summer and that he does odd jobs and
> is saving his money for a computer, he figures he's going to have 8 or
> 900 dollars available. So I said ok. I asked him what kind of computer
> and where was he going to buy it. He told me he was going to go to a
> big box or big office supply chain type of store, I told him to look
> around but that I would go with him to buy the pc, to make sure he
> doesn't get taken for a ride.
>
> Then his mother told me she wanted to buy him a laptop! Because her
> girlfriends at work told her that when he goes to college or university
> the laptop would be useful! I told her that in 4 or 5 years from now
> the laptop will make a fine doorstop or a nice Frisbee for 18 year old
> university students on a Friday night drunk! To make matters worse he
> told a clerk at a big office supply chain that he didn't want a flat
> panel monitor (for gaming) and the clerk told him that CRT's were no
> longer available and that they don't even work on new pc's! So I told
> him that my gift to him would be the monitor and that I would find him a
> suitable pc with the money he manages to save. I got him one of the
> last Aperture Grill monitor still available today.
>
> Then I thought to myself, what is the best thing to get for a 13 year
> old kid? I figured when he's 17 or 18 if he needs extra power he
> probably won't have money to buy a new pc. I also figured I may as well
> get him a 64 bit ready pc and make sure it has lots of room and options
> for future upgradability. I think I will get him a dual core, dual
> Opteron ready motherboard but I will only throw a single core 200 in
> there. Also, I think I will only put XP 32 bit on there for now, I
> think he's too young and inexperienced for Windows x64. Later on if he
> needs more he can pay for it himself! And if he does get that from me
> you can be sure that "Uncle John" will have his lawn mowed for free next
> summer!
>
> John
>
> Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:
>
>> The 100 chips are designed to be the only CPU in the system, the 200 is
>> designed to be one of two chips. A 2x200 series with dual cores would
>> give you 4 opterons, effectively. A monster board, capable of doing just
>> about anything you're likely to need. An 8way is really only for
>> servers.. Realistically, a single CPU, with dual cores, is probably more
>> than
>> pretty much any normal user needs.

Charlie
Mon Dec 26 15:37:16 CST 2005

Oh - and don't go to Office Depot/Max/Whatever. Stick with a place that
specializes in building PCs. So a local system builder, if you have one, or
www.directron.com, www.ncix.com, www.newegg.com, etc., etc.

--
Charlie.
http://msmvps.com/xperts64

John John wrote:
> Thanks Charlie. The pc is for my 13 year old nephew. He called me
> about 3 weeks ago and told me he wanted money for Christmas! Then he
> explained that he mowed lawns all summer and that he does odd jobs and
> is saving his money for a computer, he figures he's going to have 8 or
> 900 dollars available. So I said ok. I asked him what kind of computer
> and where was he going to buy it. He told me he was going to go to a
> big box or big office supply chain type of store, I told him to look
> around but that I would go with him to buy the pc, to make sure he
> doesn't get taken for a ride.
>
> Then his mother told me she wanted to buy him a laptop! Because her
> girlfriends at work told her that when he goes to college or university
> the laptop would be useful! I told her that in 4 or 5 years from now
> the laptop will make a fine doorstop or a nice Frisbee for 18 year old
> university students on a Friday night drunk! To make matters worse he
> told a clerk at a big office supply chain that he didn't want a flat
> panel monitor (for gaming) and the clerk told him that CRT's were no
> longer available and that they don't even work on new pc's! So I told
> him that my gift to him would be the monitor and that I would find him a
> suitable pc with the money he manages to save. I got him one of the
> last Aperture Grill monitor still available today.
>
> Then I thought to myself, what is the best thing to get for a 13 year
> old kid? I figured when he's 17 or 18 if he needs extra power he
> probably won't have money to buy a new pc. I also figured I may as well
> get him a 64 bit ready pc and make sure it has lots of room and options
> for future upgradability. I think I will get him a dual core, dual
> Opteron ready motherboard but I will only throw a single core 200 in
> there. Also, I think I will only put XP 32 bit on there for now, I
> think he's too young and inexperienced for Windows x64. Later on if he
> needs more he can pay for it himself! And if he does get that from me
> you can be sure that "Uncle John" will have his lawn mowed for free next
> summer!
>
> John
>
> Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:
>
>> The 100 chips are designed to be the only CPU in the system, the 200 is
>> designed to be one of two chips. A 2x200 series with dual cores would
>> give you 4 opterons, effectively. A monster board, capable of doing just
>> about anything you're likely to need. An 8way is really only for
>> servers.. Realistically, a single CPU, with dual cores, is probably more
>> than
>> pretty much any normal user needs.

John
Mon Dec 26 16:15:17 CST 2005

Don't worry about that... the only thing I buy in these places are
staples... and pencils...

Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:

> Oh - and don't go to Office Depot/Max/Whatever. Stick with a place that
> specializes in building PCs. So a local system builder, if you have one, or
> www.directron.com, www.ncix.com, www.newegg.com, etc., etc.
>

John
Mon Dec 26 16:31:58 CST 2005

Thanks for the advice. An x2 or an FX? The graphic card is a given.

John

Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:

> Don't waste your (and his) money on a dual opteron board. Get a good "gamer"
> board that does Athlon64 and put a dual-core in there. Spend the money on
> the graphics card(s) for it, and plenty of RAM. He'll be fine for years.
>

Colin
Mon Dec 26 22:19:27 CST 2005

FX is not dual core. FX is very popular among gamers, however, and is a
reasonable choice. Dual core is also a reasonable choice for gaming. Dual
core is more forward looking but there are no bad choices being suggested
here. I use a dual core and they are slick.

--
Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
(Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)
"John John" <audetweld@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote in message
news:uB7DQwmCGHA.412@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
> Thanks for the advice. An x2 or an FX? The graphic card is a given.
>
> John
>
> Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:
>
>> Don't waste your (and his) money on a dual opteron board. Get a good
>> "gamer" board that does Athlon64 and put a dual-core in there. Spend the
>> money on the graphics card(s) for it, and plenty of RAM. He'll be fine
>> for years.
>>

Tony
Tue Dec 27 02:17:50 CST 2005

I agree, there are no bad choices. In fact, this is a case where everybody
can be right, and you'll end up wasting money. If this is a 'First PC', I
usually recommend going for a 'Second Hand', in this case, I would suggest
checking with an 'Internet Cafe'. They typically change their gear maybe
twice a year. First Rate, last years machines. Gives the person a chance to
sink in to the 'Driver's Seat', let's them develop their own ideas about
what they would realy like to have - which probably is quite different from
anything that is foreseeable 1 - 3 years in advance.

So, if you'd like to have your lawn tended to over a reasonable period -
save 'some' of the money now, and help him get that next machine that he
configures himself.

(The Brit's have a saying: "If you fail to prepare, you'll prepare to
fail!")

Tony. . .


"Colin Barnhorst" <colinbarharst(remove)@msn.com> wrote in message
news:O%23XK9ypCGHA.628@TK2MSFTNGP14.phx.gbl...
> FX is not dual core. FX is very popular among gamers, however, and is a
> reasonable choice. Dual core is also a reasonable choice for gaming.
> Dual core is more forward looking but there are no bad choices being
> suggested here. I use a dual core and they are slick.
>
> --
> Colin Barnhorst [MVP Windows - Virtual Machine]
> (Reply to the group only unless otherwise requested)
> "John John" <audetweld@nbnet.nb.ca> wrote in message
> news:uB7DQwmCGHA.412@TK2MSFTNGP15.phx.gbl...
>> Thanks for the advice. An x2 or an FX? The graphic card is a given.
>>
>> John
>>
>> Charlie Russel - MVP wrote:
>>
>>> Don't waste your (and his) money on a dual opteron board. Get a good
>>> "gamer" board that does Athlon64 and put a dual-core in there. Spend the
>>> money on the graphics card(s) for it, and plenty of RAM. He'll be fine
>>> for years.
>>>
>
>